PS!! Bata Neart’s VDSD entry link is in the top right corner!
Friday the 13th, unlucky for some but not for Aoife in this case since she’s been gifted her school cardigan back by an ever softening Áine. Ashling may be a little concerned about the continued lack of lower clothing, but given that Aoife doesn’t mind it herself, no point in making a big deal of it 🙂
But they are getting close to the road, and although we have a good idea of how long Áine has been frozen, the girls have no idea of this. Things are about to become….interesting….
Welcome to the 21st Century Áine…you’re in for quite a few surprises 🙂
Just to add the previous PS!, VDSD 2015 is underway and if you can safely see NSFW material, please check out the VDSD link to the top right of the comic or click on the links down here:
The Complete List of Valentine’s Day Sex Drive2015 Participants
Nate Hammond – Jazz and Jess (NUDITY HERE) | Captaingerbear –Grant | Alli Perry – Out of My Element | Miluette – Lovefeast | Juno Blair – Star Cross’d Destiny | Dave Barrack – Grrl Power| Jackarais – Bicycle Boy | Andrew Hunter – Delve | Bearalzebub – Devilbear: The Grimoires of Bearalzebub | Rabbitual Offender – Rabbitual Offender | Raven Perez – Raven’s Dojo | Jeromatic – Bunny Wiggins | Spaces – Holy Bibble | Nick Greaves – The Great Isle of Prentil | Zach Vanzile – West Tree Academy of Heroes | Jeremy Begin – After the Dream | TK Doherty –Nikki Sprite| Doomy – Demented | Mike Aston and Shaun Nicholls –Lacey Investigations | Lou Graziani – CyBoar | John Harrington – The Savage Sword of Sharona | Niauropsaka – Raspberry Rain | F.T. Benjamins – Holding Pattern | Phil and Max – Indifferently Evil | Yellowgerbil – Zoe the Vampire | Mark Egan – Bata Neart | Mark Egan –Back Office | Peter Anckorn – By The Book | Amy Letts – Epic Fail | Casey J. – Buying Time | Sean Harrington – Spying With Lana | Vas Littlecrow Wojtanowicz and SA – Rasputin Catamite | Vas Littlecrow Wojtanowicz – Rasputin Barxotka | R(ed) – Meiosis | Byron Wilkins –1977 the Comic | Stef Marcinkowski – Sarah Zero
Well, Aoife is easy to please. Giving her back her sweater that you stole from her gets a “So nice <3" huh? That wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that the sweater is being returned by a pretty girl, would it? Nah, couldn't be. 😉
I think that nudity taboo is one of those things that either you get it or you don't. It's really not logical – I mean why is a string bikini that shows a lot more skin than Aoife is at the moment perfectly okay but underpants aren't? Unless you're a lot better at explaining things than anyone I've ever met, I really doubt you're going to get anything other than a blank look from someone who doesn't already understand it.
(Not that I would know anything about that from personal experience. It's not as if I've ever been completely baffled by apparently random clothing rules or anything.) 😉
Nooo…it wouldn’t have *anything* to do with the pretty girl returning her clothing….nope….not at all 🙂
Agreed on the whole nudity taboo. When it comes to coverage, underwear and swimwear tend to be the same (or less in some cases). I’m going to guess that it’s down to context. It’s not unexpected to see someone in a string-bikini on the beach….but it is unexpected to see that same thing downtown in a city. Also, western culture has sort of classed underwear as ‘private’. Thus it’s something that you are not supposed to see in public. I think it’s more of a social habit than anything else.
I feel that it shouldn’t really matter, as no real harm is being done when it comes to what people choose to wear (or not wear). However, it’s likely that there are people out there who will go out of their take offence to the likes of this, and that makes me think that in general, our shared society still needs some maturing to do in this area. (Sorry for the soap-box speech)
Speaking of nudity, this weekend is Valentines and my comics Bata Neart & Back Office are joining VDSD 2015! If you don’t know it, it’s a webcomic event featuring nudity, and I break my usual overt fan-service rule (which I break regularly anyway…like this week…), to join in. Aine represents Bata Neart this year. If you are interested, click on the VDSD link in the top right. Be warned though. Everything past that link is NSFW!
Áine and Aoife are too cute but Ashling’s expression in the last panel is the best. XD
I think the nudity thing is based partly on culture/geographical and personal views. I’m not too bothered by most forms and even less so if the person partaking in it (so to speak) doesn’t care. Something only attains value if someone puts value in it. If Aoife is comfortable walking around in the near nude, others would either see her as confident, oblivious or shameless… Or just not bat an eye. But maybe that’s wishful thinking? Then again maybe my way of reasoning is because I’m Swedish? Or it’s just a personal thing that somehow coincide with a stereotype?
I’m glad you enjoyed Ashling’s expression, thank you for saying 🙂
I think you’ve got it there Jen. It does seem to be where you are and who you are the currently governs attitudes towards how much skin is exposed. I’m not certain if you reasoning is just Swedish 🙂 Although I’m Irish, I’ve lived here in Oslo, Norway for the past 8 years, and the Norwegians seem to be similar in attitude to this (although they can also be extremely conservative depending on who you encounter).
Just so everyone else knows, Norwegians and Swedish although similar, and quite distinct from each other. Swedes are excellent organisers, while Norwegians…are…well, excellent at crossing the Swedish border en-masse for cheaper booze and tobacco 😀 (I kid)
I think Irish people can be a bit of mix attitudes. Catholic Ireland is very much becoming a thing of the past, and the strict modesty rules attached to it are quickly melting away. However you’ll still get a good deal of modesty in recent generations, as well as a good deal of exehibitionism in the other extreme. Many Irish may form an option or two if someone appeared to be too lightly dressed, but that would usually be the limit of it.
@Kessy Athena: The main difference is that although bras and swimsuit tops are roughly the same weight, underpants (both men’s and women’s) are thinner, more revealing fabric than swimsuits.
As far as personal choice in attire goes, A Russian advertising firm posted billboards featuring nude breasts as part of their ad campaign. Traffic accidents skyrocketed. Apparently the (non)wearers aren’t always the ones at risk. ^^
Rawr, do you know if it would have been culturally approriate for Aine to be in a relationship with Aoife (or any other girl, for that matter?)
Hey, it’s your soapbox, Rawr, rant if you want. ^_^ However, I’ve been happier (or at least less aggravated) ever since I stopped expecting people to make sense. Or society. Or just the universe in general. To me, nudity taboos are just one of the many weird nonsensical things people do. Like ties and high heels – it seems to me their mere existence is absolute proof that we do not live in a rational universe. Or why Americans absolutely refuse to use dollar coins. Of the great, great many things that I wish my culture would grow up a bit about, nudity is honestly way, way down the list.
I’ve rather been under the impression that the western nudity taboo is largely one of the less salubrious legacies of christianity, and that it’s weaker in Scandinavia since christianty never rooted itself as deeply in the culture there as the rest of Europe. But I’ve never really looked into the issue, so I’ve no idea how correct my impression is.
@Delta-v: Yes, that is true, but swimsuits are designed to born worn while wet, most underwear is not. Personally, I don’t really see much difference between the two under normal wearing conditions, but I’m often clueless about clothing, so… (shrugs)
@Delta: I remember that story from Russia. No doubt they were going for the old ‘sex sells’ methodology for advertising, which alas worked all too well in that case 😀
@Henri: Hi Henri! And welcome to Bata Neart!
In modern Ireland it would certainly be culturally appropriate for them to have a relationship. There’s even a few laws in place to safeguard against discrimination, and there’s soon to be a referendum on same-sex marriage (which I’m cautiously optimistic will gain a ‘yes’ vote)
Back in Pre-christian Ireland, where Áine comes from, there’s still a lot of missing information. I like to think that attitudes towards sexuality was a little more open prior to the arrival of Christianity in Ireland. For example in Celtic Ireland, it apparently wasn’t unheard of for a woman to take various spouses (at the same time). Once Christianity came in, the moral rule-book started to change and no doubt homosexuality began to become a taboo. Áine will lack a lot of the modesty that has come from those later years, and think in general as a character she will be a lot more open to new ideas 🙂
@Kessy: I can certainly agree that trying to making sense of people can be a bit of challenge. I wouldn’t try too much myself, since people are….well….people 🙂
Regarding Scandinavia, you’d be very surprised. Jen would know better than I would with Sweden, but here in Norway you can find very religious folk. Even go way up North to where the indigenous Sami people live, and you’ll find that they can be extremely Christian. Naturally, in modern Norway, attitudes on the whole are more liberal, and things like nudity might attract attention but not all that much surprise. It’s not unacceptable, unless you happen to be very conservative. But that conservatism is alive and well in Norway, and will still be around for a few more years, I think.
Well, I only meant that in relative terms – that christianity had had less of a cultural impact in Scandinavia than in, say, Southern Europe. I didn’t mean to suggest that there weren’t any conservative christians there at all.
Although please bear in mind what my frame of reference is, being from the US. When you say “conservative christian” to me, I think of people who talk about Biblical Law, burn Harry Potter books because they’re trying to recruit young people into devil worship, and are convinced that climate change can’t be happening because Yahweh promised that he’d never destroy the world again after Noah’s flood. And no, I’m not joking or exaggerating about any of those. Believe me, I wish I was.
@Kessy: In comparison to other places, you are indeed very right. Scandinavia isn’t as affected by Christianity as counties further south in Europe.
Alas, I completely believe what you are saying about conservative christians in the US. In comparison most conservative christians in Northern Europe, the US variety do seem quite extreme. In Europe they would typically be a little old-fashioned regarding some topics, but wouldn’t tend to take the Bible literally, or even argue against the teaching of Evolution in schools. The fact that’s even in an issue for debate in the US, bamboozles many of us of us over here in Europe. Same goes for burning Harry Potter books, honestly that’s just silliness.
I can only imagine how they’d react to Bata Neart 😀
Hey, hey, hey! Rawr, congratulations are in order! According to the TWC website, Bata Neart is now in the TWC Top 100! Brace yourself for a flood of curiosity seekers!
@Delta: Thank you 😀 I noticed just a few minutes ago. I am gobsmacked…I never thought I’d ever see one of my comics on the first page of TWC, I was already in disbelief to see Bata Neart in the Top 200, but at actually see double-digits on my TWC ticker is truly incredible.
I can’t say thank you enough to all of you who’ve voted. It’s truly touching that the comic has such dedicated readers who vote for it. I know Bata Neart’s VDSD entry has something to do with a lot of votes, but it wouldn’t even be close if it wasn’t for all of you.
I’ll ask Aoife to go around to all of you to give you a thank you hug (and she’ll earn me a whole load of flight-miles in the process)
LOL Trust me, Rawr, it bamboozles many of us here in the states too. If you’d suggested to me 20 years ago if there’d be a debate in the US about teaching evolution or any of the other stuff that’s been going on, I’d have laughed at you. I think the fundies are just feeling cornered and are lashing out in any way they can. That plus all the people who can’t deal with a black man being President…
To be fair, most christians in the US, even most conservative christians are not that sort of nutters. The crazies are just very loud, very visible, and unfortunately have a lot of influence and political power in the christian community. And burning the Harry Potter books was really just a publicity stunt.
@Rawr: I’m not the only one who thinks you’re worth it. 🙂
@Delta: Thank you Delta 🙂 Really needed to hear that today as well. Feeling a little drained lately, but knowing that I have readers who care gives me the extra energy to do my level best to draw fun Bata Neart pages 😀
Also, Bata Neart’s in the Top 50 now…I’m wreaked with everything happening…but I’m a happy guy…and a happy cartoonist too 🙂
I second that you deserve it. Currently #46. Let’s try to keep it up!
Karen is somehow even more beautiful than Áine. Those who do not read Back Office should still, absolutely, check out that VDSD image!
Also, I’m from Sweden, and I reckon that the somewhat more open attitude towards nudity around here simply stems from our special relationship to sunny weather. When spring breaks loose, we almost go crazy…
Christianity was deeply rooted in Sweden for quite some time, but yeah, not for as long as in southern Europe. And we have recently been known as the worlds most secularised country. It still seems everyone has a more or less distant relation to the church, usually more, and most often slightly positive.
I should also reiterate that there is a lot more cultural difference between Sweden and Norway than most people would guess. Those who study history supposedly have very good explanations for this.
@Kessy, your words on people not making any sense are very, very close to my thoughts on the matter. I may or may not have some personal experience. 😉 But I’d say that the universe, the laws of nature, physics and engineering does make perfect sense – with very few exceptions.
While I wrote, up to #45 on TWC! And you still deserve it 🙂
@O8h7w: You are far too kind 🙂 Admittingly, I had spent more time planning Karen’s VDSD image, but I’m delighted that you regard her drawing as beautiful 🙂
I’m married to a Norwegian, and I often work with Swedish folk here in Oslo, so I can only echo what you are saying. Sweden and Norway have plenty in common, but they are indeed very distinct from each other. I had noticed that your source ISP was Telia, and I was wondering if you were indeed from Sweden 🙂 Two Swedish comments on the same page: makes me wonder if I should start doing comic-cons in Sweden 😀 (Seriously, might be a good idea!)
Congrats, Rawr, for having both Bata Neart and Back Office on the TWC front page. I think you’ve got a virtuous feedback cycle going here. ^_^
@ O8h7w : Yeah, I was thinking earlier that there’s a certain irony that the Scandinavian countries have relaxed attitudes towards nudity, considering the climate. But I think I like your idea that the climate contributes to the attitude.
Personally I really dislike the term “laws of nature.” If you think about it, in human society laws are rules that are created and enforced by a top down authority of some kind. They’re prescriptive: you shall do something, or there will be consequences. Natural “laws” on the other hand are entirely different. They are descriptive, not prescriptive. There’s no cosmic traffic cop handing out tickets to enforce F = ma. Rather these laws are descriptions of how we observe things behaving that are determined in a bottom up sort of way. The idea of violating the laws of physics is actually nonsensical, if you think about it. The laws are determined by what happens, so if something happens, then by definition the laws must be adjusted to accommodate it.
@Rawr: Huh, maybe. I think there might be another Swede or two over at Not A Villain, but don’t quote me on it. I think I saw one on the Ponyleaks forum several years ago as well…
@Kessy: Yeah, that is a bit confusing, but I think we can blame the mathematicians. More specifically those of ancient Greece. You see, mathematical laws are both constructed and nonsensical to break. The founding fathers of mathematics essentially told their students and each other “we have to do it like this, all of us, or it won’t make sense”. Somewhere down the line the mathematical meaning of ‘law’, now ‘it must be like this or it doesn’t make sense’, transferred over to physics and on to many aspects of science.
Also, I feel that there is something very very right in that ‘laws of nature’ are a very different thing from laws of man. And I’m thinking you agree on that?
@O8h7w:
Sorry, couldn’t help myself again 😀 (I like playing with the image tag).
It is interesting to know where my readers are coming from, and it’s useful to know that there might be a good chunk of web-comic readers over the border in Sweden 🙂
@08h7w: Ha! That makes me think of Dennis Auroux’s lecture on non-independent variable problems: “That’s quite a conflict of notation with what we had before. I think I can safely blame it on physicists or chemists.”
Saying that natural “laws” are very different things from human laws is pretty vague, so it’s hard to disagree with. But it depends on how you think of them as being different. My attitude is that the universe is what it is and does what it does, and is under absolutely no obligation to make sense to humans. When it does I think we should look at it as the universe doing us a favor, not as a normal state of affairs.
Although an important point to remember is that whether or not something makes sense is a very subjective thing. Does it make sense that torqueing a gyroscope makes it move at right angles to the way you’d think it would? The math works out, but it’s certainly non intuitive. On the other hand you can create mathematical constructs that are entirely self consistent but don’t make any sense in that they bear no relation to reality. So whether something makes sense is very dependent on your point of view.